Friday, February 13, 2009

Dogs Competing for Their Lives/Owners Competing for Their Rights


In the dog training world, legislation may be coming soon to regulate the dog training profession. As with all legislation, this is something that I could both welcome or be concerned about. I would welcome it if it did so to secure professional conduct and results. I do not welcome it, if it comes just to ban tools or methods. I also do not welcome it if it is to bring training to be prescribed by veterinarians who know nothing about training dogs. I also don't want to see this trend promote or degenerate the expected training performance of the professional dog trainer (as a result of some current trends in dog training today).

There are those in the dog profession, who feel that a measurable test of their skill in training a dog is useless or unnecessary. I disagree strongly, especially when reviewing what is going on with our world and the world of pet ownership today. One way professional dog trainers keep up on their skills is to compete in measurable tests of their training skills. I want this to become a requirement for all professional dog trainers in the future in order to keep our business and profession as successful as it can be. Success being measured in not only the ability of dogs to keep their homes or acquire their homes, but also in the ability of owner's to keep their rights of enjoyment of their dogs AND dogs to keep their rights to be able to exercise unencumbered (but not untrained).

My Concerns: It has been in the best interests of the Veterinarian community to secure market share by taking over the industry of dog training as well. They have done this by emphasizing scientific and behavioral studies in dog training, rather than also (or at all) focusing on skill in dog training. Every dog trainer should be aware of the theories, methodologies, and their history. However, being able to actually train a dog to a measurable standard (there are tests out there put on by the UKC and AKC) is equally important. These groups largely believe that it should not be required for a dog trainer to show any measurable skill in training a dog. They say things like "it's unimportant, people just want companion dogs" or "why spend all this time on a behaviorally challenged dogs when there are all these other "nice" dogs out there. (article to follow on some future date)



People like Ian Dunbar, of Dogstardaily.com, has been one veterinarian that did not sticking to his introduction of puppy classes and the correct upbringing for a dog. Although having earned nothing beyond a Companion Dog title on his own dog, he considers himself the authority figure on dog training at advanced levels and in adult dogs that have behavioral problems. In my opinion, this has been a great marketing scheme for him and others, which is motivated primarily by greed not by accomplishment or concern for dog and owner welfare. His stay on the Association of Pet Dog Trainers created a huge rift in the dog community, and offshoot organizations such as Truly Dog Friendly and the No Shock Collar Coalition. Names that sound innocent enough until you realize the misrepresentations and lack of knowledge of the dog training tools in question by these very groups. These groups and Dogstardaily seek to suppress and misrepresent the truth, which is apparent in that they do not allow open discussion unless it directly agrees with their views. For instance, you can not discuss how the Koehler Method of Dog Training ACTUALLY works, you can only discuss the bad parts of it, inaccurate or not. You can not explain the modern technology of e-collars that now offer various levels that include very gentle and almost imperceptible levels. You can not talk about how these are not used mostly as aversive or coercive, but as a gentler piece of equipment than the training collars with the additional benefit of better timing and off leash control. You can not discuss these things with these groups unless you misrepresent or present ONLY the cons to this group of "trainers".



NOTE: The Koehler Method of Dog Training is a progressive training program that relies on the owners putting the time and effort in to train their dogs. The problems usually come about when people do not follow the instructions in the book, go to fast, and become frustrated. Becoming frustrated and too harsh to dogs IS NOT ANY PART of the Koehler Method of Dog Training, in my opinion.



It's the results of these marketing tactics that cause misinformation to leak out to your average dog owner, that concern me most. Also the trend of some Veterinarians, such as Tuft's own Dr Dodman, who have in the past gone for medicating a dog rather than training a dog. Some of this has reported to have changed at Tufts, but I have had talked personally with at least two owners who did not find their answer in a pill as prescribed. Additionally, there was my own experience before I became a dog trainer, where I was expected to fax in the problem to Dr Dodman for my faxed back medical analysis. I am glad I was intelligent enough not to do that. Not all dog owners are aware of the pitfalls of these practices and the lasting harm that can be done.



This redirecting of the training industries to professionals who do not regularly train dogs to any standard AND do not recognize their own limitations, has increased the lack of knowledge that average people have of dogs and how they learn, in my opinion. Dogs that are studied in laboratory settings are not in real life situations. Theories, while good to know and contemplate, do not account for the flesh and blood living right in front of you. Unfortunately this has caused more and more people to be unaware of how to train and care for a dog. Instead, they expect a dog to be more and more like a stuffed animal, without the will to exercise, explore, and be an active living being.



My Hope: If there is legislation coming to regulate the dog industry, it takes an unexpected and welcome turn. One, it should require all dog trainers to demonstrate, through testing to a standard, their ability to (at the very least) train their own dog to this standard. I think further, that they should be able to train a client and the client's dog to take the test as well.



A multiple choice test of other skills and understanding of methodologies and science can also be given, but the tests for certification as a dog trainer through state or federal law need to include proof of skills. There are organizations out there that do give these sort of tests through Video and live demonstrated ability, I believe they should be included in the legislative plan. The NADOI and IACP both give certifications based on demonstrations of skill. IACP is in the process of revising their video taped test to be taken by dog trainers that will be titled as professional. The NADOI already requires uncut video tape of the demonstration of a trainer's abilities. There is no sane reason, in my opinion, why a professional dog trainer should not be required to submit proof of their actual ability to train. There should be NO EXCUSE as to someone in the field claiming that this is not necessary. If you are a professional dog trainer, you should be able to train a dog, at minimum, in basic obedience in a measurable way.

Behavior modification needs to be based on client satisfaction ratio, I think. It's relative to what the dog was, what the client expected, and is there improvement in both the lives of the dog and the clients. A multiple choice test in behavior theory will not flush out those results, although it may be useful just to be sure the dog professional is aware of these. However, a multiple test on theory is just a memorization exercise. Many times a dog of a different upbringing may give signals that veer from the path of theory to the path of reality.

What is the harm in not expecting professional dog trainers to be able to take a measurable real time test of their skills?

Here are just a few examples of legislation that is currently overtaking the United States by storm, due to poor or sloppy or no training?

Breed Specific Legislation
Limits of Numbers of Dogs that Can Be Owned
Dogs Banned from Public Areas
Leash Laws that Do Not Allow for Any Off Leash Places Outside the House

If professional trainers do not have the skills to train a dog, how will owners be able to train their dogs? Who will they learn from? Distaste for dogs in the non-dog owning public will grow, and these laws will continue to infringe on the rights of the responsible dog owning public.

Here are some other organizations unconcerned about the quality of training a dog and owner may be taught, in my own opinion:

People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (if you don't know their agenda, you should educate yourself)
Humane Society of the United States (Ditto)
Truly Dog Friendly (wants to direct methods and tools to be used, but does not place any emphasis or reliable training or the rewards of reliable training to both family and dog)
Dogstardaily.com (Ditto, and has many members from the Veterinarian community who have not trained dogs to any standard, as well as the main portion of their trainers that do not believe in training to any standard, of either their own or their clients' dogs)

14 comments:

Anonymous said...

"There is no sane reason, in my opinion, why a professional dog trainer should not be required to submit proof of their actual ability to train. There should be NO EXCUSE as to someone in the field claiming that this is not necessary. If you are a professional dog trainer, you should be able to train a dog, at minimum, in basic obedience in a measurable way.
Behavior modification needs to be based on client satisfaction ratio, I think. It's relative to what the dog was, what the client expected, and is there improvement in both the lives of the dog and the clients." (your words)

In my experience, the obvious flaw in dog training
is that while many trainers are "dog people" they
can not translate that into being "good with people" and all top level training (in any field) is measureable,
you are given critera in the beginning and both you and the instructor can gage whether or not those critera have been met, why or why not, physically demonstated, sadly I have yet to find this in dog trainers.

what I have found is rude elitist punishing techniques both towards the dog & owner that pose as professionalism, but are nothing more than self-reinforcing hogwash. I don't think it's entirely limited to dog training either, as I have seen similar things in horse care & training.

as far as proof of skill goes this does not mean aversive, temporary results, this means non-aversive, positve-reinforcing, long-lasting behavioral training & modification, that results in a happy animal, not a broken one

veternary studies show
these methods work better, so how can the
positive long lasting effects of good training
be aquired, documented, tested, & proved
given today's environment?

Robin said...

Oh, it's another anonymouse LOL.

I see my customers as boarding clients after training has ended. Some for four or five years now. The results that were accomplished have not been temporary.

Measurable results that clients are happy with that are not "elitist" or extremist (ahem) are what dog owners who care about their dogs are looking for.

Why don't you try to post under your non-mousey alias LOL.

Funny I have a dog here that has been treated by veterinarians and people who don't recognize training outside of giving treats (dog has food intolerance and no love for hands).

Let me guess the non-training, positive, "dog friendly" answer for that euthanasia. Look at the case under "Hoobie" where do you see the horribly punishing methods LOL.

Robin said...

I see it a took a mouse a few months to think up an answer too.

Because there is no good answer for people to not have to prove their competence in an area.

Just easier to fling word arrows, by alias no less.

Anonymous said...

pretty defensive aren't we? I don't know you from jack, in my particular region of my state there are people claiming to be experienced trainers and having participated in their classes, it's obvious they rely on aversive techniques, are not aware of what's going on with the owners or dogs in the class and generally don't care about results.

this is dangerous not just irresponsible & cruel

furthermore a behaviorist, certified should be able to diagnose the stress threshold of a dog in a single session and not yank the shit out of them, trying to force a dog-dog interaction, if I had followed her directions to the letter, it would have killed my dog. so this comment is my quest to find how you measure actual results, not just anecdotally, and it's not directed at you, I'm trying to find an answer to why it's so hard to find a qualified, humane instructor

trainers can get away with (and they do) instructing hanging, misappropriated pinch collar use, punishing techniques, but once you have a certification CAAB no less, it carries weight and responsibility, reason enough for me to keep my name out of litigation, okay

I didn't visit this site until recently, hence the untimely post, and hoped you might have advice
for dog owners who are completely fed up with paying good money for nothing yes, we want results, and if we fail, we want to know why, & how to proceed, not some ambiguous comment that "we're going to help you get control of your dog" or "he thinks he's in charge" where exactly does someone get measurablity out of a comment like that?

I am currently reading Culture Clash by Jean Donaldson & The Power of Positive Training by Pat Miller, both of these books have techniques to measure your own progress, I just found them last week, I wondered if you do this, or anything like it and could something like it be standardized?

you seem to have a lot of knowledge about the industry, so how about it?

Anonymous said...

LOL, I am defensive?

Second, anonymouse, I didn't make any of those quotes you just quoted. Perhaps you would like to say who your source is, and not attribute them to me!

Yes I have met my standards by competing my dogs in obedience, by improving my knowledge in training, and last but not least, by being able to produce customers that will testify to those results and their abilities to work with their dogs.

My customers don't pay money and get nothing. In fact, I would fully refund a balance if anyone thought so.

But the ones who are getting results by immediately telling someone to put their dog to sleep in one session LOL, probably do collect their fee and kill a dog that might have otherwise gone on to live a happy and productive life.

YOu can also see my resume on my site.

I am going to stop responding to anonymouses, because they don't have the balls to stand behind what they say OR give me their real life or test qualifications to measurable standards LOL.

Of course I measure my standards. Some of those cases can be found right on my blog.

Good luck with the Jean Donaldson book LOL.

Anonymous said...

just looking for advice, it's on your front page, you could have just directed me there

Robin said...

It's not hidden, and a simple question did not need an anonymouse long post that started with an attack.

Do the minimum of research next time.

Anonymous said...

attack on who?

I'm not from your state

I never met you

I thought I agreed in my 1st post with what you said

my area isn't like your school

I just wanted to know why it's like that here, when what you do is so different?

dog trainers here suck

when you google stuff it doesn't always take you to a current page or topic, so here I am

Robin said...

I don't know why it's like that there. We have the same problem here, but with people lacking in skill with mediocre techniques. When you find proof of their skill in their own video, they will not own up to the fact that they can and should be better at what they do.

"as far as proof of skill goes this does not mean aversive, temporary results, this means non-aversive, positve-reinforcing, long-lasting behavioral training & modification, that results in a happy animal, not a broken one

veternary studies show
these methods work better, so how can the
positive long lasting effects of good training
be aquired, documented, tested, & proved
given today's environment?"

Your above statement in your first post sounds an awful lot like the agenda of the extremists that visit me here. Balanced training uses all tools that are right for the dog. Sometimes when an owner comes to us asking for the five minute, fun, and treat filled answer to an aggressive dog, it's our job to insist they either get someone else OR do the work requested.

Some dog trainers may be rude because they aren't good and/or lack people skills. I can't say why in your area that would be. Seems the entire other sect of dog training has taken over this geographic area.

Robin said...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jaA4k4SdTg

If you are enamored with Jean Donaldson, you should check out this video on her site.

I've always wanted to teach my dog how to do this. NOT and EWWWWW.

Robin said...

Oh God, and Pat Miller. You should really click on her tag on my site, and read some of her quotes.

Really screwy people who make a lot of money having people attend their seminars.

http://mannerlymutts.blogspot.com/2008/06/who-is-trying-to-supress-information.html

Yeah, she is dog friendly, as long as that defintion includes the death of a dog that can not learn by only her techniques.

Anonymous said...

I do not feel the use of a shock collar, is appropriate in any training, the koehler method is one I would not use

Culture Clash describes my dog's behavior, I agree with using positive reinforcements, food, toys, playtime, exercise, and especially socializing with lots of other people & dogs

the training schedules in The Power of Positive Dog training are something I can do myself with confidence

I still think trainers should be able to show proof of skills, but I don't think E collars or dominance like the outdated koehler method is appropriate, the first one adversly affects the nervous system,
the other affects the psychological well being of the dog.

Neither promotes a healthy dog-owner relationship.

Robin said...

The first one adversely effects the nervous system???


LOLOLOLOLOL. Alllrrrrighty.

I know what I am dealing with now. What about the steps of Koehler's molding and shaping (not your ignorant and misinformed dominance) don't you like?

Glad Culture Clash is "helping" you. I am sure you are on your way to a well informed solution.

Thanks for the laugh this morning.

Robin said...

OMG, no you are right. This is very serious business. You know those tens units that people use? It uses the very same technology. QUICK WE MUST GET A PRESS RELEASE OUT NOW. MILLIONS OF AMERICANS ARE GETTING NERVE DAMAGE FROM THEIR TENS UNITS!! What do you live in the back hills or something where dogs are tied to car batteries for an electonic collar? LOLOLOL.


Oh, have you heard the other truth (myth). They burn the neck, don't you know. That's why dog hair goes up in flames, and we have all these dead dogs LOLOL>

I doubt anyone you know actually uses the Koehler method if you think it's jerking.

Why don't you go edumicate yourself somehwere else? I don't have time for dumb a$$s like yourself.

No wonder dog trainers are rude to you.